I think my CP4 has started to eat itself....

[Timd32]

I was looking at this last night for a possible new RAM... Some other companies out there as well doing CP3 conversions. 10% of a $70K truck is $7,000.00 So a $2,700.00 CP3 kit is less than taxes paid... To bad it would give FCA an easy out on warranty. Regardless fixing OEM beancounter disasters is where the aftermarket really shines.

https://ssdiesel.com/new-product-feature-2019-ram-cp3-conversion-kits/

Rebates look strong right now.

If you can swing it and have a possible good dealer that would provide a decent loaner, whats the real down side is what I figure, run it and enjoy your new truck. Stuff breaks, they will figure this out is my opinon.

With rebates I've been seeing some nice loaded Tradesmans, yep that's a thing and it really is nowadays. They run around $55k for SRW 3500 and all the technology you can put on one lane departure the safety group, trailer backup cameras all over, rear air suspension and the sort.

Deals to be had. We need more out there so that if they are bad they get properly sorted out faster and on to the next issue.

 

[Wiredawg]

I'm looking forward to reading about the first TDR member to purchase and install the conversion. I don't have a dog in the fight as I have a 2017, but still interesting reading.

Even bigger on the horizon is what, if anything, will Cummins and Ram do to address the issue.

Just for perspective, I thought buying my former 02 Ram 3500, the final year and actually final run of the 2nd Gen truck, would have the best chance of the VP4 to survive. Not so, it failed at 34,925 miles, replaced under factory warranty. It then survived 198K miles when I sold it.

Anyhoo, I'll still be following this on all the threads being posted.

Cheers, Ron

 

[R.Taylor]

I'm looking forward to reading about the first TDR member to purchase and install the conversion. I don't have a dog in the fight as I have a 2017, but still interesting reading.

Even bigger on the horizon is what, if anything, will Cummins and Ram do to address the issue.

Just for perspective, I thought buying my former 02 Ram 3500, the final year and actually final run of the 2nd Gen truck, would have the best chance of the VP4 to survive. Not so, it failed at 34,925 miles, replaced under factory warranty. It then survived 198K miles when I sold it.

Anyhoo, I'll still be following this on all the threads being posted.

Cheers, Ron

I'm on the fence and almost ready to make the jump on a CP3 kit... The 2 that are on the market have pending CARB certifications, They've been submitted and they are both just waiting (I've spoken with both). There is no reason for CARB to deny them as they do not change anything in regards to emissions. I know that my entire vehicle warranty can not be voided. What would be voided would be the pump and anything related after it (injectors etc). After putting near 450k miles across 4 CTD Rams... I've never had an injector issue (let alone an engine issue). Say my transmission failed.... FCA can not deny warranty work solely because I installed a CP3, It would be their duty to show how a CP3 caused the failure. Honestly, I doubt the CP3 would even be noticed by the service department OR the smog inspection tech. If I did have an issue I could always get towed home first, Pop the CP4 back in and then take it in. I've already talked to my service advisor of 16 years regarding installing a kit and what would be the repercussions, The benefits outweigh the downsides for sure.

 

[R.Taylor]

The fun part is that no one knows how a permanently over clocked CP3 held up.

Not all CP3 kit options are over-clocked..... Some are simply stroked.

Quoting S&S...... offering kits with high-speed optimized competition pumps. Higher pump speed equals higher output, yet there are RPM limits for each size pump.

Pump Speed Limits
10mm High Speed – 8,000 pump RPM | 5,333 engine RPM
12mm High Speed – 7,000 pump RPM | 4,667 engine RPM
14mm High Speed – 6,000 pump RPM | 4,000 engine RPM

Cummins says the 2019+ RAM 6.7 is governed to 3000rpm, I think the high speed pumps are for the drag/pulling guys with custom ECM's.

 

[EDankievitch]

I’m not seeing the issue with using a CP3 pump. Before 2019 they were squeezing just shy of 1000 ft/lbs out of the CP3 pumped engine. They held up just fine. Higher rail pressure? Only time you see full rail pressure is when you max it out. Most of the time your not running any where near full pressure. Unless I’m understanding this all wrong. When I have my scan tool hooked up my rail pressure is never near the max in normal driving.

 

[Tuesdak]

@Timd32 the place of a breakdown and the risk is different for some. Middle of Death Valley when its 121 degrees out presents a survival situation. For me: removing a known weak part for a better one just for better odds is worth every cent of the $2700.00

The warranty is iffy at best on the fuel system due to possible fuel contamination. So voiding it isn’t the end of the world. But FCA claiming performance mods may void the entire warranty. Would this be covered if it was a dealer installed accessory?

Questions like this put GM back in the running just to stay away from the CP4. Half the reason for a new truck is the warranty and not having big repair bills.

 

[Timd32]

@Timd32 the place of a breakdown and the risk is different for some. Middle of Death Valley when its 121 degrees out presents a survival situation. For me: removing a known weak part for a better one just for better odds is worth every cent of the $2700.00

The warranty is iffy at best on the fuel system due to possible fuel contamination. So voiding it isn’t the end of the world. But FCA claiming performance mods may void the entire warranty. Would this be covered if it was a dealer installed accessory?

Questions like this put GM back in the running just to stay away from the CP4. Half the reason for a new truck is the warranty and not having big repair bills.

Gotcha ya.

Yeah not something you can even carry a spare of.

GM's are nice I have a 2019, 6.2 gasser. Interior and gadgets galore. No issues to speak of, have had a GM since 2007 all have been just fine for me.

Good luck if you decide to pull the trigger on something.

 

[DonFitzwater]

R.Taylor....I still think you are jumping the gun a bit. I’m not a betting man but I doubt you’ll have a problem. Drive that sucker and enjoy it! That’s what I’m doing. 11k and counting.

 

[Bug Out]

I made the 2500 mile trip this(have 5K on the clock) weekend and no issues!!! Love the truck, towing is a breeze but I gotta tell ya the CP4 lingering thoughts has me petrified to go to Illinois next summer as planned...I can't tell you not believing in a machines ability to get you there and back, worrying about whether FCA will tell you, "sorry, its your problem, metal in fuel" 10K bill has me rethinking why I RV at all.

 

[DonFitzwater]

I made the 2500 mile trip this(have 5K on the clock) weekend and no issues!!! Love the truck, towing is a breeze but I gotta tell ya the CP4 lingering thoughts has me petrified to go to Illinois next summer as planned...I can't tell you not believing in a machines ability to get you there and back, worrying about whether FCA will tell you, "sorry, its your problem, metal in fuel" 10K bill has me rethinking why I RV at all.

Have you thought about therapy?

 

[Jim W]

I made the 2500 mile trip this(have 5K on the clock) weekend and no issues!!! Love the truck, towing is a breeze but I gotta tell ya the CP4 lingering thoughts has me petrified to go to Illinois next summer as planned...I can't tell you not believing in a machines ability to get you there and back, worrying about whether FCA will tell you, "sorry, its your problem, metal in fuel" 10K bill has me rethinking why I RV at all.

I have the tools and my older son has the knowledge on how to work on the Cummins engine. Since he was part owner of a diesel performance shop at one time. Life and family got in the way so, he backed out of the side business.

 

[AH64ID]

I’m not seeing the issue with using a CP3 pump. Before 2019 they were squeezing just shy of 1000 ft/lbs out of the CP3 pumped engine. They held up just fine. Higher rail pressure? Only time you see full rail pressure is when you max it out. Most of the time your not running any where near full pressure. Unless I’m understanding this all wrong. When I have my scan tool hooked up my rail pressure is never near the max in normal driving.

So I’ve been thinking about this for a few days and still not 100% sure about a CP3 in the CP4 application. Here’s why, pressure not power.

We all know the CP3 can move enough fuel, heck I was making ~475/1000 at the flywheel on a very mild tune with a stock CP3 and only ~21.7K psi at the rail (lower than stock). My CP3 wasn’t working hard to do it either. The QSB 480 (5.9) marine motor cranked out 480 hp on a CP3 at ~21.7K psi. The QSB550 (6.7) made 550 hp on a CP3, but I don’t know at what pressure.

The thing they all gave in common is different emissions requirements. So it’s not the peak volume of fuel it’s the sustained high pressure to meet emissions and make power. The 19+’s do emissions things different.

So, can the CP3 survive higher sustained rail pressure?

Just thinking out load, not saying it won’t work.

I need to dig into the 19+ pressure tables one of these days.

 

[BigPapa]

Middle of Death Valley when its 121 degrees out presents a survival situation.

If you’re worried about breaking down somewhere like that, then why go there? I’d be more worried about a brake line or hose failing in the mountains. That’s a survival situation.

 

[BillBaker]

I just got a 2019 3500HD ... It's got 28k on it. I just drive it, it's a nice ride. I go off the old saying about worrying... "why worry? Yesterday is the past, the future is unknown"... take things one day at a time.

 

[gsbrockman]

I made the 2500 mile trip this(have 5K on the clock) weekend and no issues!!! Love the truck, towing is a breeze but I gotta tell ya the CP4 lingering thoughts has me petrified

Petrified? Realllllllly?
If I were more torn up than a soup and sammmmich......I would ditch my worries tomorrow morning at the closest GM or FoMoCo dealer.

 

[EDankievitch]

No worries.
Chrysler’s Road side assistance will bail you out. Truck an trailer.
I had a fuel jumper on cylinder number 4 fail on my 05 back in 2007. They had me off the road in under a hour. Truck an trailer. No charge.
Truck fixed in under 5 hours. Ok it was an easy fix but it went smooth. Even offered me a loaner while I was waiting.

Now that was back in the Dalmer Chrysler days....
Who knows how FCA will handle things......

 

[Bug Out]

Have you thought about therapy?

No. Just don't need the hassle of having a customers RV hooked to my truck and a CP4 going out, leaving me with the logistics of completing the RV move on my dime. No more long distance tows for me.

 

[Bug Out]

Petrified? Realllllllly?
If I were more torn up than a soup and sammmmich......I would ditch my worries tomorrow morning at the closest GM or FoMoCo dealer.

Let me requote. Not petrified, but a little disappointed that a 70K truck has this issue. Keep your pre-2019.

 

[SnoKing]

No. Just don't need the hassle of having a customers RV hooked to my truck and a CP4 going out, leaving me with the logistics of completing the RV move on my dime. No more long distance tows for me.

This is really sad, as I see RAM "working" on the road all the time. It has been the go to vehicle because of reliability. Now to have the CP4 cloud over it is a great mistake on Cummins' and RAM's part to use this injection pump. Bosch should be ashamed to have created such a product and continuing to market it despite the known issues. All the bean counters in this path to the lowest cost item should be made to drive vehicles with CP4 pumps.

 

[gsbrockman]

Let me requote. Not petrified, but a little disappointed that a 70K truck has this issue. Keep your pre-2019.

Guess what? My 2018 RAM 4500 is currently at 269k miles. Technically......I’m at a mileage range (and out of warranty, I may add) that ANYTHING can happen. CP3 puke? Throw a rod through the side of 6.7L? AS69RC puke? Transfer case puke? Front or rear axle puke? Turbo take a dump? Wiring harness melt like a Hershey bar on a S’mores?

In any event.......every time I turn the key could be an adventure.

My point is......I don’t live in fear. I deal with it if and when it’s dished out.

I have a Citi Preferred card in my billfold (member since 1988) with zero balance and a $25,000 credit limit. If the schittttttttt hits the fan.....I’ll pull it out, deal with the situation at hand, and move forward.

If I start hardening up (read: petrifying) before a major malfunction.......I’ll head to GM or FoMoCo and try Brand Y or Brand Z for a bit.....