My Banks nightmare story

[driverno8]

OK I'm going to try and make this short... I just signed up here (TDR) strictly to tell you guys my story with Banks. I also hang out at some other sites (some might recognize me, hey there).



I went with Banks for a few reason, one I was new to diesels and they had big shiny red ads, second, was the fail safe that was built in and third was it wasn't suppose to void my warranty. Here you go, my story.



My truck had 11,017 miles on it when it went BOOM! I was a little over 2,000 miles away from home (IL. I live in CA) towing a 12,000lbs 38' Scarab. The #5 cyclinder was burnt so bad that a chunk of the valve broke off and rattled around. Yes, my temps were fine and the 6 gun was at 4 (lower then Banks's recomendations for towing) Once the motor was torn down we found that the front 3 cyclinders were fine and the back 3 were all toast (that's why gauges or the Banks Speedloader didn't catch it) I started to deal with Peter Treydte (suppose to be the #3 guy over there) He was initially shocked that this could happen and said he'd never heard of this happening with any of their products. And guaranteed me that they would work with me and they stood behind their product. Banks claims it's a fueling issue and they don't deal with fueling, only timing. (Those that know the Cummins, know there are to banks (no relation) of injectors, 1-3 & 4-6). I agree. But, if half of your motor is injecting fuel at a different time then the other half, that's a timing issue. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out. Once the Cummins codes showed that this was a timing issue they stopped talking to me. (Dodge and Cummins have same codes numbers but they mean the different things) Once Scheid Diesel (Banks distributer) sent over the code list from Cummins (not the Dodge codes) Peter said, and I quote, "This doesn't look good for us, we'll get back to you. " That was the last I ever heard from them, It's since been 6+ months. They have refused certified letters from my attorney, they won't return calls, e-mails, nothing (pretty chicken ****). The warranty on my 10 month old truck is now under "warranty restriction". The dealer my truck went to in IL (Hosick, cool people. Dealt with the owner. Got a new dually CTD 600 to get us home. Gave it to me at cost) could have cared less about what was done to my truck, but they are only allowed to do so much before they have to call DC out to look at the truck. DC is the one that said no way. Banks doesn't stand behind their product at all. Try calling to speak with someone between the hours of 12-1 PST. The whole company goes to lunch, even their tech support, what happens if you have a problem between those hours? No one! That's a whole differnent story - like breaking down on the freeway a week before it blew. Truck shut off while towing a 10,000 lbs rv and merging into traffic. Dead stop on the busiest freeway in California. All because of them. I had to unplug their system while stopped in the slow lane, Lot's of fun, semis blowing by me at 70mph, I'm laying under truck, you get the picture. Anyway, Banks should be embarrased about the claim that they have a great product, great tech support and that they stand behind their product. The company is **** joke. Once they take your money, you are no one. period. Don't think for 1 minute that if you take your chip out, reset your batteries and take it to a dealer that they won't know. The dealer might not, but if the problem is bigger then the dealer, they will know. I paid for my new motor myself. A stock crate motor was $8500 installed from the dealer. (Since is was down to the block I did have some fun with it and spent quit a bit more, plus trannie upgrades. Thanks to Scheid in Effingham! You guys rock!) I get so worked up over this whole oreal I start to shake. I just wanted you guys to hear this from someone first hand, not through the grapevine like I'm sure some of you had. I learned my lesson, and I hope other people don't make the same mistake I did. And from what I've heard, I'm not the only one this has happened too.



On anther note. I've been over here (TDR) a few times to read but now that I'm a member I'll start posting.



* * *

Edited out profanity.



Robin

TDR Admin

November 11, 2004

 

[lschultz]

Thanks for sharing

Very interesting. The word Banks caught my eye. I have been thinking about getting there exhaust but the price makes me think and I don't need a stainless. I have been waiting on MBRP to come out with there full 4" downpipe(like Banks) on there aluminized exhaust since August.

 

[TCDiesel]

Driverno08, Did your EGT say up,What I mean is when you let off the go pedal how fast of drop did you see,I Have seen this happen before without the banks setup,Although being a banks installer I will remain neutral until all things are measure and consider equable. Also did you install it.

 

[driverno8]

The temps did drop. How fast, dunno no. Normal I guess. I know that they drop faster now. My guage pyro was after turbo, the speedloader pyro was pre. Now my guage is pre so it does move a lot quicker then before. Yes I did the install. Then took it out on the freeway (see above). Banks reinstalled it at their Azusa facitity. A week later it blew up.

 

[JMusso]

Interesting, I have the Banks 6 gun bundle installed for a few thousand miles and I usually run it on #4 while regular driving and towing about the same weight(11,000lbs). Knock on wood I haven't had any problems. Maybe Peter Treydt can respond as to what happened, he posts on here once in a while.

 

[TCDiesel]

I understand you were pulling a huge Boat when this occured,You did not blow up your engine ,you Burn it down. I also check some of your posts,Quote:THE pedal seems to be on the floor alot and my mileage was on the floor also,My MPG has gone down because I can"t keep my foot out of it. Life is to short to worry about mileage,TST Awesome mod!!. I am looking for traction Bars for My Truck . Are you going to blame TST when this one burns down Or Scheid Diesel, Or Ats etc. Diesel are pulling engines and when you set them up for racing under certain conditions they will fail. Scheid diesel set you up nicely,But you need a uprade on your foot.

 

[Cummins4Life]

I understand you were pulling a huge Boat when this occured,You did not blow up your engine ,you Burn it down. I also check some of your posts,Quote:THE pedal seems to be on the floor alot and my mileage was on the floor also,My MPG has gone down because I can"t keep my foot out of it. Life is to short to worry about mileage,TST Awesome mod!!. I am looking for traction Bars for My Truck . Are you going to blame TST when this one burns down Or Scheid Diesel, Or Ats etc. Diesel are pulling engines and when you set them up for racing under certain conditions they will fail. Scheid diesel set you up nicely,But you need a uprade on your foot.

I thought the banks "brain" was set up to keep temps safe no matter where the throttle is at? Banks doesnt advertise their product as a "racing product", its supposed to offer more power, mainly for towing is the impression I get, and safetly. In this case it sounds as if their product is at fault or didnt function properly.



Of course a simple $120 pre-turbo pyro probably would have saved a lot of time, money and frustration.



Sounds like you got a raw deal to me, but I'm glad you got it back on the road with some nice products under the hood.

 

[TCDiesel]

It does,If it detects anything above 1250* it will drop to stock until five lockups,or until stop than above 50 mph for a lease 2 minutes,The Tuner can easily check to see what mode it was in last operation. I don"t remeber right off hand how long store,if the unit is sent to Banks or someone with a bitwriter they can check it. The entire engine operation can be check with the DRB III, I would have ask for A print-out.

 

[TCDiesel]

I talk to the people at Hosick,GREAT DEALER. DC made the call not, the dealer. DC would blame the fuel if they could in like manner GM is doing to some of their injector issues.

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Since the back 3 cylinders fried, are those the 3 the wastegate doesn't relieve of backpressure when it opens? Wait, I think the 3rd Gens have 1 entry port into the turbo so when the wastegate opens it should relieve all 6 cylinders.



I suppose the back 3 fried because of the lousy stock exhaust manifold. The airflow of the front 3 cylinders is good but the back 3 is quite tortured especially 4 and 5. Possibly the Banks pyro sensor was faulty, and/or installed where it was reading the front instead of rear cylinders.



Just tossing out some thoughts.



Vaughn

 

[CATCRACKER]

running it hard with a big load and a chip will do this. if your guage reads 1250 not all cylinders are 1250 likely others are much warmer. pulling a load at a sustained 1200 can burn a piston. from what i hear anyway.

 

[Tomeygun]

is there some way we can tell which cylinder is hottest on our own rig?



like a infer-red(sp) heat gun??

 

[TCDiesel]

If the Pryro wires are shorted the tuner would have pick up on it and set a code,Just one example the tuner is so fussy that if you hit the adjustment dail with your knee it may set a code, any short in wiring will set a code,end result stock HP/TQ, If the Pryro sensor is in the front port ,maybe 75* cooler, anything after turbo 250 to 350. It is important to have per & post if you pull heavy and hard,If your post starts climling to within 150* of per {if position right after elbow} I would start to back off, or downshift and raise my RPM"s and lower My boost , Med to Low boost & low Rpm"s= HEAT. Med RPM & Low boost= less heat. Med RPM"s and MED boost ok heat.

 

[driverno8]

Couple of things here. First. The pyro that is pre-turbo was in the location that Banks says to put it in their instructions/directions. So it wasn't in the wrong spot. Second. My guage on my truck (at the time) was hooked up after turbo. I didn't go with Banks gauges because I wanted white. There for there was two pyros on my truck. Both don't go bad. My guage at the time it went boom was a tick under 700º. Add on, say, 300º max, and I'm still only at 1000º. This can be said even not towing. My gauge never read higher then 700º. Hope I didn't lose you on that. Third. (My mistake here) Both the 6 Gun and the Speedloader were shipped form Scheid Diesel to Banks. The 6 Gun came back as a faulty tuner (for the second time). Now, there's no way to prove this other then that's what Peter told me on the phone. So they can deny it all day long. Fourth. The 6 Gun tuner in the truck was the second one I'd been through. And I also went through 2 wiring harnesses. On the first harness, wires came out of one of the plugs. And the first tuner I sent back also came back as bad. Fifth. The couple of months their system was plugged in, my truck would sputter sometimes going down the freeway. Hard starts. Would shut off while ideling. White smoke. LOTS of black smoke. Just had a mind of it's own. Everytime I'd get in the truck I would wonder if it would work or not. Six. The codes that were pulled (Cummins codes, not DC) show all of these symptoms as being timing issues. Not fueling like Banks claims. Seven. I don't race my truck. I tow with it. That's why I bought a 3500. And if I do want to run it from one light to the next, wide open, I will. Because there is NO doubt in my mind that every single person on here as done that. That's why we BOMB our trucks. And yes. Life is way to short to worry about fuel mileage. I Last. Remember, everytime I unplugged their system or took it out, my truck was perfect. Last. If Banks claims that their system is safe, and that's why they don't up the power, then keeping my foot on the floor shouldn't cause any problems.



On another note. I would love nothing more then for Peter to get on here and post his response. Or anybody over there for that matter. In fact they can call me, my numbers on my profile area, because I'm sure they have forgotten about me. As they will anybody else after you purchase their crap! And to answer your question, yes I'm bitter.

 

[TCDiesel]

Mr driverno8,Motors burn down every Day,I certainly understand your bitterness,Yes tuners go bad ,I had a tuner short out on a customer 2004 Duramax last week,I also on my personal truck had 3 Commanders short out,Their wiring Harness had the Ground and the hot wire reversed,Mat at ATS was disscussed with me, I email him pictures of the harness and thats when he discovered it was wired wrong. Before we install the bank systems we check for codes or input output changes. Also I can only answer for myself. If you were my customer I would have remove the tuner ,Plug in the DRB III and check every code, fuse,circuit,progam,configuration,input & output,senor,injector both engine and transmission handed you a print out and return your Money. I hope you have much better luck with the New truck it looks like it off to a good start. Some members with TsT and stock turbo had to upgrade, It cannot handle all that boost at higher levels.

 

[SAvery]

You know I am very sad for this case. Not long ago, before the advent of common rail systems, I used to believe in aftermarket upgrades. But now that I hear the horror stories and know the computer shows more than you know, I am definitely going to leave my new 05 stock when it arrives. With the expense of these engines due to the complex computer controls, I find it crazy that some people will gamble with their warranty to gain just a little more power. Something to be said for simplicity and having a valid warranty.

 

[tschwab]

You know I am very sad for this case. Not long ago, before the advent of common rail systems, I used to believe in aftermarket upgrades. But now that I hear the horror stories and know the computer shows more than you know, I am definitely going to leave my new 05 stock when it arrives. With the expense of these engines due to the complex computer controls, I find it crazy that some people will gamble with their warranty to gain just a little more power. Something to be said for simplicity and having a valid warranty.

I couldn't have said it better myself. TDR had an article several issues back, titled "The factory Knows best". I quoted that in a post a while back and took some flaming for it, but it is stories like this, that really make you want to leave your new truck 100% stock, which I am doing. Aftermarket vendors are probably cringing when they read this.



You upgrade your motor/drivetrain, you then become your own warranty station. Pretty simple, huh?! I don't blame DC one bit for voiding motor/drivetrain warranties on BOMB'd motors.

 

[moolie]

i have a six gun speedloader with ats injectors and i can peg my phantom white face at 1600 but the truck runs fine and has plenty of power dyno's at 541 with 1042 and that was only with 32 # boost on htb2 turbo

 

[moolie]

i can't believe the pyro temps never over seven i mean on cruise control at 75 with 10 lbs boost and the killer b turbo i'm still riding at like 800 to 1000, i can get it to thirteen at a redlight really quick if your pyro never went over 700 there is something wrong. I have my setup preturbo, for both the six gun and my gauge and i can't believe that they never get up above 700 that's crazy there is definitely something wrong with that usually mine idles at almost 450

 

[Cooker]

Here is what I don't understand... This box is supposed to have safety parameters built into the box to prevent damage to the motor. They state their product will not void the warranty. They say they stand behind their products 100% Their product fails to perform as advertised and it is the customers fault