2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission My steering sucks...

[fbadmaev]

I ordered the DSS and Luke's Link from Mr Bob. Does your list cover my 97 3500 4x4? I want to do this right the first time.



Thanks

Frank

 

[Chipstien]

Muchsnow, I am confused which parts are needed off your PDF. There are Napa numbers and advanced auto numbers. Do you need all of them or just take a pick?

 

[muchsnow]

Muchsnow, I am confused which parts are needed off your PDF. There are Napa numbers and advanced auto numbers. Do you need all of them or just take a pick?

The red highlighted are the retrofit parts, yellow additional information, click on the highlights for other info.
It's two lists (Advance and NAPA in one file, check them both) they cover 99 to 2001. You can also check profiles of others in work on this mod for different year additional info.
Does that help?

 

[muchsnow]

I ordered the DSS and Luke's Link from Mr Bob. Does your list cover my 97 3500 4x4? I want to do this right the first time.

Thanks
Frank

2500's & 3500's share the same parts for this. For 96/97, If your original setup looks like pic in post 47 from TFABIAN (note stabilizer configuration), you may want to contact him for the details of his install and which tierod end at the pitman arm he used. I think he's finished his truck, but hasn't posted any details yet.
He may have used the 98/99 end which differs from (stud length) 2000 to (same, I checked, question from prior post) 2002.

Have a good one... .

 

[Chipstien]

The red highlighted are the retrofit parts, yellow additional information, click on the highlights for other info.

It's two lists (Advance and NAPA in one file, check them both) they cover 99 to 2001. You can also check profiles of others in work on this mod for different year additional info.

Does that help?

SO then the advanced auto and Napa are the same lists... . just different brands. That's good since the advanced is actually Part America which in my neighborhood is Schucks. You can see from my sig that I have a 2001 Ram 4X4 2500 like you... . how did you mount up a stabilizer? And would this still work even though my truck has the 2" Skyjacker coils in front? Thanks.

 

[Chipstien]

3 of the 6 needed part #'s from PartAmerica.com are showing as not available. You can only get those from a local store IF they have them in stock which none around here do. However all the Napa numbers are available.

 

[Chipstien]

Well went down and bought all the parts to do the "T" conversion. Ended up going with Moog parts from the local Big Wheel. All I can say is OMFGawd. I haven't even got the alignment yet and it drives better then the day I drove it off the showroom floor. I have been fighting this damn front end since the odometer turned 20000 miles and all it took to fix it was about 350 in parts. I have all the original parts with the exception of a Luke's link on the track-bar. Truck now has 75350 miles and finally drives like it should. I wonder if all these people buying new steering boxes and DSS's are just throwing money away when they should be fixing the front end. Muchsnow..... thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. Oo. Oo. Oo. Oo. Oo. Oo. Oo. .

 

[SnoKing]

Well went down and bought all the parts to do the "T" conversion. Ended up going with Moog parts from the local Big Wheel. All I can say is OMFGawd. I haven't even got the alignment yet and it drives better then the day I drove it off the showroom floor. I have been fighting this damn front end since the odometer turned 20000 miles and all it took to fix it was about 350 in parts. I have all the original parts with the exception of a Luke's link on the track-bar. Truck now has 75350 miles and finally drives like it should. I wonder if all these people buying new steering boxes and DSS's are just throwing money away when they should be fixing the front end. Muchsnow..... thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. Oo. Oo. Oo. Oo. Oo. Oo. Oo. .

Money spend on a DSS or TBK is not wasted, as those part do wear out. Just another part of the puzzle and hold the weight of the Cummins up front. Could you list the Moog part numbers for us. SNOKING

 

[muchsnow]

Feedback....

SO then the advanced auto and Napa are the same lists... . just different brands. That's good since the advanced is actually Part America which in my neighborhood is Schucks. You can see from my sig that I have a 2001 Ram 4X4 2500 like you... . how did you mount up a stabilizer? And would this still work even though my truck has the 2" Skyjacker coils in front? Thanks.

Glad you're happy with the mod. I honestly felt the same way (about the contrast between before and after) , just wanted to drive it through a variety of conditions. Wait til you get it in the gravel and road construction areas (big difference in control). Just one thing that has been noted is possible contact with the tierod ends and rim at lock to lock steering. Not a big issue however I had to use wheel weight tape in the inside of the rims because I broke a wheel weight cranking it one time. On my JEEP there's a adjuster for wheel travel to eliminate this, so I will probably figure out a way to do this on the Dodge front axle. They're both DANA's, I'm sure something easy can be done about it.

FWIW, haven't seen the need to put a steering stabilizer (damper) on it at all yet, I'm sure you will soon understand why.

As for the lift, when I leveled mine I found it relocated the axle about a inch to the left. This would affect proper steering box center and vehicle track. So with any alteration in ride height, I absolutely recommend installation of a adjustable track bar to get it back where it's supposed to be for optimal vehicle operations.

Others may differ, but the ruler tells the truth.

Have a good one,

L. J. M.

 

[Chipstien]

Money spend on a DSS or TBK is not wasted, as those part do wear out. Just another part of the puzzle and hold the weight of the Cummins up front. Could you list the Moog part numbers for us. SNOKING

Shouldn't have said that the DSS is wasted money. Meant to imply that I wonder how many could have spent the money on this and corrected their problems.



As for numbers... . Moog , TRW, Mcquay Norris, and Tread Saver are just a few of the popular brands that all come from the same place..... Federal Mogal. Hence all the numbers are the same. Just ask for these numbers and they should match up with whatever they happen to carry.



DS1459

DS1456

ES3496

ES3498S



Those are the parts needed for the conversion. That replaces everything except the tie-rod end at the pitman arm and the corresponding sleeve. If you suspect that your tie-rod is bad then these are the numbers for that... .



ES3497 (99 models)

ES3527 (00 and 01 models)



And if you choose to replace the last sleeve if for no other reason then because everything else is new, here is that number. (Remember that this is NOT needed as your old system uses the same one and this is a non-wearing part)



ES2012S



Even those using the Allied numbering system, (Napa etc. ) can look up these part number by cross referencing.

Remember that the "T" conversion has no spot to use the factory Dampner so you WILL lose that. However there are numerous option to install one from the likes of Rancho and Skyjacker to name a few.



Well I think I have covered the basics. Again my hat goes off to Muchsnow for figuring out the necessary part numbers needed for this conversion. Good Luck.

 

[BroncoMarc]

I finally got around to making a video of my steering. . I'm assuming this is a result of bad ends at the knuckles that's letting my tie rod rotate??



Just under 1 meg:

http://www.broncomarc.com/temppics/dodgesteering.wmv



Now it's pretty obvious why 'My steering sucks', huh??



My 98. 5 already has a T setup. When I looked up the part number for mine at advanced I got all the same part numbers you had for the 99. So I assume this will just get me back to what it was like when it was new. .



What the heck is drivers side inner, outer and passenger inner and outer?? Which one is drag link driver's side/passenger's side and tie-rod driver's side/passenger's side??

 

[KevinLewis]

Cool Video. I could swear by watching that vid that I can see the axle moving back and forth under the truck. By watching the angle of the sway bar links and also comparing the spring to frame distance. Your trac bar may be good but it shure looks like that axle moves back and forth alot. Or i am i just crazy????????

 

[SnoKing]

Looks to me that the axle end of the track bar is moving a little also. SNOKING

 

[BroncoMarc]

The track bar is easy enough to change. . I've got a lifetime warranty one from advanced. I just changed (for the 2nd time) it in Aug. though. .

 

[muchsnow]

I finally got around to making a video of my steering. . I'm assuming this is a result of bad ends at the knuckles that's letting my tie rod rotate??



Just under 1 meg:

http://www.broncomarc.com/temppics/dodgesteering.wmv



Now it's pretty obvious why 'My steering sucks', huh??



My 98. 5 already has a T setup. When I looked up the part number for mine at advanced I got all the same part numbers you had for the 99. So I assume this will just get me back to what it was like when it was new. .



What the heck is drivers side inner, outer and passenger inner and outer?? Which one is drag link driver's side/passenger's side and tie-rod driver's side/passenger's side??

Looks like it could be wear, gotta watch doing that alot without rolling (manual steering days). The synthetic bushing between the rod end and knuckle is supposed to keep that to a minimum, but if the rod end is worn it can only do so much. Does greasing it good seem to take up any slop? Try to compare this movement with the tires off the ground (jacks on axle, no suspension drop, weight on axle) if it's still there, definite wear. Just be aware also that cranking the steering on a stationary tire contact patch w/a ton of detroit sitting on top of it can be a little torquey on multiple items. if you have sector shaft wear you should definately be a ble to see it w/ the tires on the ground. Enough thought for the moment, gotta go... .

I thought you had the T rig...

OBTW with the tires up, you shouldn't easily be able to rotate the centerlink by hand due to the bushings (rubber, poly, whatever) that's on the studs.

You may be correct though, I don't know what your miles are but it just might be renew time. CHA-Ching $$$ (you gotta spend it to save it though).

Have a good one.

L. J. M.

 

[amnewsom]

I am awaiting my new T-style that should arrive Thursday. But my woes are due to someone running a red light a smacking my front pass. side - good thing the wheel took the impact w/o any damage other than surface scratches. They left I drove off with a bent drag link/tie rod, that was 2 years ago. I have dealt with it long enough. Thanks for posting all the info, this thread should move into FAQ to help others or at least the list of part numbers.



Thanks muchsnow

 

[BroncoMarc]

I finally got around to working on mine. Since my problem is just with the tie-rod rotating, I'm just going to replace it for now. I went out and bought both tie rod ends and the sleeve. (Part #'s ES3496, DS1456, ES3498S)



(note - I've already got a T setup, so I'm just replacing stock parts for mine)



I pulled the old tie rod off and checked the ends. The balls don't have any slop in the socket, but there is no resistance in there. The studs are free to flop back and forth. I'm sure this is my problem.



I'm assembling the new tie rod and I've run into a problem. I measured the old tie rod at 60 13/16 from grease fitting to grease fitting. I'm trying to get the new tie rod set to that length, but I've got both tie rod ends screwed into the sleeve until they bottom out and I'm still an inch too long.



Any suggestions??

 

[muchsnow]

BroncoMarc centerlink?

I finally got around to working on mine. Since my problem is just with the tie-rod rotating, I'm just going to replace it for now. I went out and bought both tie rod ends and the sleeve. (Part #'s ES3496, DS1456, ES3498S)

(note - I've already got a T setup, so I'm just replacing stock parts for mine)

I pulled the old tie rod off and checked the ends. The balls don't have any slop in the socket, but there is no resistance in there. The studs are free to flop back and forth. I'm sure this is my problem.

I'm assembling the new tie rod and I've run into a problem. I measured the old tie rod at 60 13/16 from grease fitting to grease fitting. I'm trying to get the new tie rod set to that length, but I've got both tie rod ends screwed into the sleeve until they bottom out and I'm still an inch too long.

Any suggestions??

Both ends should be started and the sleeve rotated to engage the threads an equal amount, Lube the sleeve well so you can turn it by hand when installed. You should be able to butt the ends together (or nearly) in the center of the sleeve. Alot of this stuff doesn't have the threads cleared well so you end up doing it. Easiest way after cranking it together, is to mount the center link to both knuckles with it cranked all the way in (should be obviously toed in) and adjust out until the tires appear near straight (front axle on jacks, tires on, crank out, recenter tires, repeat, etc. ) then break out the tape measure and using a good tread lug row across the back of the (front) tires just under the lower control arms and the corresponding lug row on a straight shot across the front of the tires (or as close as you can get). Try to get these the same. You can actually dial in a little "bench toe in" at this time. A sixteenth to an eighth of an inch narrower in the front measurement can get you to the alignment shop. It really helps to have two people with this, but it's not too difficult. When this is done your drag link should be close to dropping in. if not, turn the wheel so it does. if you need to recenter the steering wheel, the draglink is the only sleeve you adjust not the center link.

Remember: centerlink sleeve adjusts toe in only. draglink sleeve adjusts steering wheel center only.

To others: I've been busy chasing a APPS problem lately which I just finally just up and replaced. Boy does that improve the the performance over having adjusted to one that's on it's way south.

Is it just me, or do these things only seem to have around a 70K life span?

Also... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... . , is there a source out there for these items (TPS/APPS manual and automatic) that doesn't leave you feeling violated from the rear on purchasing a replacement? Takes ten minutes to install but boy does it lighten the checkbook.


Edit update: ZERK to Zerk on mine is around 61 and three quarter inch, if that helps... ... ?

Also, I grease the ends before assembly and after (not the studs folks). Probably over-kill but it makes me feel I got the loaded and not loaded internals good. Also a good time to make sure you're using a good quality waterproof grease because you can shove all the factory unknown out at this time.

 

[LBARTLETT]

I had trouble with my 99', 01' and 02', I finally got ssooooo mad I got the Luke's Link fix for the tracking bar (they also will work as new tie rod ends), a Borgeson short shaft but I think what helped the most was a "steering box brace" made by Darin Tessler in Canada (cost about $130), I dropped my 02' 1 ton 4X4 quad cab off a 3' drop in a pasture and am convinced his produce kept me from having any damage. I ordered one from a friend so I do have one for sale if anyone is interested -- email address removed --



I have decided the best way I fixed my steering problems was with the purchase of a 04. 5' 1 ton quad cab 4X4 dually

 

[muchsnow]

A little bit of an update

Adobe Acrobat reader required. 5. 0 or better. Same deal as before, change . txt extension to . zip unzip it and open file with Acrobat reader. My appologies but the board will not let you upload compressed (zip) files.

Have a nice day.....