Shell Rotella T vs Shell Rotella synthetic

[Extreme1]

Oil: Full synthetic for extended drains with a bypass filter (I got 99,000 before the TBN was low enough to recommend a change), the engine will start much better below 0 too. BUT, since you can't do that, Rotella T is what I'd run.

Filter: Not a Fram! It was a Motorcraft parts counter cut-away display that showed me how evil the Orange Cans are. I think they glue the flaps together these days (used to be folded and held together with a STRING!) but the ends are still thin cardboard. $.79 is way too much for one of those. An oil filter cutter is a fun and educational tool to have around.

All oil filters have a bypass valve in them, some engines do too but you can usually delete or defeat those.

 

[Newsa]

Just compared cold pour points on product info sheets of 3 oils I have used recently out of curiosity.

Valvoline premium blue extreme 5-w40 = -38.2 F

Kendall Super D XA 15w 40 = -40 F

Redline 15w 40 full syn = -49 F

Seems like I found 2 synthetic (Kendall d is a blend) 15w-40 oils that are listed as pouring better at cold temps than 5w 40???????

 

[biotec]

In the last 2 Cummins powered pickups I had, a 1998 5.9 and a 2008 6.7, both with 245000 miles when I sold them, I used Shell Rotella T 15w40 and Fram 3976 oil filters. I thought maybe with this new 2018 6.7 I would run Shell Rotella synthetic. But 1st I wanted to get the knowledge of the gurus on here. Oil is oil and DEF is DEF so let's not get into the technical stuff. I change my oil every 12 to 15,000 miles. My main concern is, Shell Rotella synthetic is only 5w40. Rotella t is 15w40. Im in Michigan and it gets cold but never have I had a starting problem because of cold temps and thick oil.
MARK

More important than choice of oil is your choice of filters.
All those Fram filters you got for a bargin price? Toss them in the trash or put them on ebay, SERIOUSLY ! Fram is the WORST filter out there you can use, absolute JUNK, will cause problems, look at youtube cutaway on Fram filters. Parker Racor contained 26 feet of filter media paper, Donaldson was around 25 ft, Wix was 12 ft and Fram was 8 ft, not much in the way of filtering ability. The can may be pretty but it is what is inside that counts. Best filter is Parker Racor, also Baldwin, Fleetguard, Donaldson, Cat etc but not Fram or Wix,
they are cheap filters.

Synthetic oil offers better protection at high temperature and migrates to more areas, so switching from conventional to synthetic may enable oil leaks that you don't have now. I have 380,000 miles on my Duramax and 420,000 on the Cummins, have used nothing but Rotella and Chevron Delo 15w-40. Mobil 15w-40 is just as good. The Delo IsoSyn actually contains synthetic additives and seems to hold better oil pressure. When using Rotella, the oil pressure falls off earlier than Delo.
NEVER use Wix fuel filters, you can go to the Duramax Forum and read horror stories there about Wix fuel filters allowing unfiltered fuel past the seal and contaminating the common rail system causing injector failure.
It is expensive to use cheap filters.

 

[6V92TA]

funny thing about Fram is there is this consistent internet rumor that there is something wrong with them, yet I know more than one person who uses them all the time. I think the Fram story is just a rumor based on something that happened fifteen or 20 years ago. Some myths never die.

 

[JR]

funny thing about Fram is there is this consistent internet rumor that there is something wrong with them, yet I know more than one person who uses them all the time. I think the Fram story is just a rumor based on something that happened fifteen or 20 years ago. Some myths never die.

So IOW you have no issue using them?

FYI there have been documented engine failures with pictures to back it up on this forum, and I've only been around 6-7 years . It's no myth.

 

[6V92TA]

if you have any documentation it would be nice to see it instead of the claim that there are documented failures.

 

[Newsa]

So IOW you have no issue using them?

FYI there have been documented engine failures with pictures to back it up on this forum, and I've only been around 6-7 years . It's no myth.

I think it is actually 20 (maybe 15) year old info.

It keeps showing up like new info. But It's 2 decades old

 

[mwilson]

funny thing about Fram is there is this consistent internet rumor that there is something wrong with them, yet I know more than one person who uses them all the time. I think the Fram story is just a rumor based on something that happened fifteen or 20 years ago. Some myths never die.

First off to be clear...I do NOT RUN Fram filters on any of my stuff. I feel the Fleetguard is the best choice for Cummins. Mopar filters go on my Town and Country. A/C Delco for the Caddy.

Having said the above Freightliner Of Maine has sold Fram filters for over twenty years. We offer them for people that want a lower priced unit, I also stock Fleetguard, Donaldson, Caterpillar and Detroit OEM filters. Some customers want the OEM, some want the Fram.

These Fram filters are used on everything from employees personal vehicles to the biggest of diesel engines.

One complaint about 10 years ago, I put the customer in touch with Fram's claim department and heard no more. I assume it was a good outcome.

Had another customer just recently that had a dusted N-14 Cummins and they have run Fram Air Filters forever. Dust trails in the intake, the whole drill. Contacted Fram and they forwarded me to the lab. Two very professional techs assigned me a claim number and had me ship the suspect air filter out there. The lab purchased a brand new air cleaner housing to test the filter in and it passed. I received information step by step by step with great detail.
We suspect that the customer's filter housing was the culprit and that will sent to that lab to be tested just to make sure. The housing is manufactured by another company but many filter companies use that same lab. I saw pictures of the equipment used and I feel they did a thorough job in testing the filter and housing.

I know the Fram filters have a reputation but if they were that bad a filter I would know. I have sold tons of them without complaints.....

 

[mwilson]

I think it is actually 20 (maybe 15) year old info.

It keeps showing up like new info. But It's 2 decades old

From what I could find out Fram stepped up when they had the "Filter Media Plugging the Cooling Nozzles" episode. And that's been quite a while ago.

 

[mwilson]

And I'm not promoting the use of Fram, I just don't believe they are more inherently evil than a lot of other filters out there. Many filter companies share product, the paint job may differ but the guts are the same.

 

[Newsa]

I was at one point afraid to admit I was using Wix filters on here because I knew I would be ridiculed. But I was using them in conjunction with amsoil bypass filters which blow away the stratopore. OEM are not even stratopore

 

[JR]

if you have any documentation it would be nice to see it instead of the claim that there are documented failures.

Search function is there for a reason. To do your own research rather than make claims about a lack of claims .

 

[6V92TA]

I knew somebody who had a friend who had a uncle who knows somebody else who had a engine failure because of Fram filters. That's how it sounds when I read the claims.

back in the early 90's my employer sued Cummins and won, we had quite a few engine failures because of the Premium Blue we were running.
But it took lab results and a whole bunch of lawyering to win that case.

now does that mean I should think Premium Blue is junk, because of what happened 25 years ago?

 

[JR]

You seem a touch stubborn, or something
So I will repeat myself again. Sometimes a little research is in order before banging on a keypad. Since you dont or cant do even a smidgen of your own research or read threads from the beginning I'll help you out just this one time. Start on page one, you'll find an example there within the last few years.
On you to find the rest. Or not.

 

[NIsaacs]

More important than choice of oil is your choice of filters.
All those Fram filters you got for a bargin price? Toss them in the trash or put them on ebay, SERIOUSLY ! Fram is the WORST filter out there you can use, absolute JUNK, will cause problems, look at youtube cutaway on Fram filters. Parker Racor contained 26 feet of filter media paper, Donaldson was around 25 ft, Wix was 12 ft and Fram was 8 ft, not much in the way of filtering ability. The can may be pretty but it is what is inside that counts. Best filter is Parker Racor, also Baldwin, Fleetguard, Donaldson, Cat etc but not Fram or Wix,
they are cheap filters.

It appears that Fram was to blame for Cummins engine damage around 99-2000 and also at least one 6.7 in '15. I seem to recall that Napa was to blame for engine damage in the early '90's.

Excellent writeup here by TDR on filters. I do find it interesting that Baldwin wasn't in the test. Per the writer, his choice for Cellulose filters were: Donaldson, Fleetguard, Mopar and Napa....choice for Synthetic was: Fleetguard and Wix. So it appears that TDR doesn't consider the Wix/Napa, cheap..... Link to article:

https://blog.genosgarage.com/wordpr...-buyers-guide-part-two-oil-filter-comparison/

biotec, can you give us a part number for the Cummins Racor oil filter? I could not find one, only fuel filters.

 

[6V92TA]

Yes, I am stubborn, simply because I am objective and make rational judgement of most things in life based on facts, data, mathematics etc.... anyway ts weird stuff, most of the claims about filters or oils but we all know that Urban Legends dominate in a world where the unvarnished truth is that if you read it on the internet it must be true.

You gotta figure Fram is a big company, most likely ISO9000 compliant and all that gobbledeegook, and warranties their product blah blah blah.. but so does everyone else, after all the orange cans are on the shelf in almost every auto section of every chain you can think of.

But have you ever really analyzed what the tests of filters amount to and what they are really telling you. .?

NIsaacs just posted a link to the typical thorough yet mostly superficial filter comparison.There are dozens if not hundreds of these blog reads available on the internet, some written by some very astute people. One common factor is those tests dwell on the construction or the type of media and lean heavily on personal opinion and visual observation but never actually test the performance of the filter.

It would be great to read a test that tries to mimic what a filter is supposed to do, namely to test the flow rate, burst pressure , pressure at which the bypass opens or measure how many contaminants that filter will hold and somehow mimic what the filter can do but you never find those sorts of performance tests on the internet..

You might as well ask your wife what color filter you should buy

check this filtration test out http://www.calrecycle.ca.gov/publications/Documents/1493/20141493.pdf

 

[Cummins12V98]

RAM can deny warranty if you are not using an approved filter. They don't F-around anymore when it comes to warranty claims.

 

[wtabke]

My Wife said 'white', am I good?

 

[Newsa]

RAM can deny warranty if you are not using an approved filter. They don't F-around anymore when it comes to warranty claims.

Do you have a list of approved filters?

A list of filters that Ram has approved?
Surely if they are going to deny warranty based on which filters are approved, they must have a list of approved filters.

 

[6V92TA]

to the best of my knowledge they don't have a list of filters but they do have a list of approved lube oils.