Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) timing setting

[pathaymond]

My question I hope is very Basic I am interested in the optimal timing setting for engine longevity and Power.

I am not stock Dynoed at 350 flywheel.

Right now my engine is in many pieces due to what has been explained as improper timing.

I am hearing 15. 5 degrees as the sweet spot.

I have a 98 12 valve with 104K and a messed up engine.

I will set my own timing and rebuild my own engine it may take me several months but at least if I screw it up it wont be because I let someone else do it for me and take my money 2.

I will not name names those that caused this are already aware of How pleased I am with there service.

Thanks to all for your honest seat of the pants experiences.

Patrick

 

[Jim Fulmer]

15. 5 is a good all around number.



Jim

 

[Futures1]

Timing;

Hi again Patrick. . There should be an "ENGINE DATA PLATE" located at or near the front of your engine... on the left side of the timing gear cover. On this plate should be marked the timing (Timing -TDC) for that engine. Cummins suggests that the advance be set at no more than 1 degree in advance from that number.

Many engines may get away with 1+1/2 to 2 as long as all is well. Remember, as an engine breaks in or carbon begins to build up... compression also increases and the threat of pre ignition damage increases !! This may take thousands of miles to surface.

I realize that there are lots of thoughts and variables in this area, and an over advanced engine may run well under high rpm and low stress conditions. But with advanced timing, when the engine begins to work hard or get hotter, pre ignition occurs and the heat builds up more quickly to the point where damage is VERY quick to follow. This can happen faster than some guages can indicate the temperature rise to the driver and of course once (if) the cylinder (s) lose compression, the temp will drop again. . (so will the power) !!

This can happen so fast that on occasion I have been unable to shut down the load on the dyno in time to avoid internal damage. This type of damage is nearly always in the piston, piston rings and upper cylinder areas.



Futures1

 

[pathaymond]

Thank You for your Input Jim and Dick.

The damage you describe is the exact damage I have number 6 was destroyed. and the other cylinders showed alot of damage . I am now 100% sure that from the dealer many miles ago to the recent events that other peaple were and are the reason my engine is now torn down. If I could only prove it in a court of law I would do just so. I at the time of destruction was pulling 25 lbs of boost egt was 1000 I was at the top end of a very long pull when things went bad. My Mom always said when you get lemons make lemonade!! I am making lots of it right now. Thanks again for your information It is very helpfull.

Patrick

 

[mikel]

Just out of curiosity, do you have any idea what the timing was set to?



Thanks,

Mike

 

[Rammin On]

Just out of curiousity ... ... where is your pyro probe? pre or post turbo? If you were running post turbo ... 1000* is way to high for a long hard uphill pull ..... you can just about bet you we over 1350* If this is the case ... . the damage was caused by excessive heat from the pull.



How much weight were you tuggin up your long pull?



I have my timing set at 20* and have for many many miles tuggin lots of weight ..... I never let the EGT get beyond 1250* on a hard pull ...

 

[1dslram]

I ran 17* timing and dynoed at 383 hp with 370's, HX35-40 hybrid by me and 3,000 rpm kit. Now at 19* with Piers stupid pump, Pius H2E, and dynoed over 500 hp. I tow with no problems and this truck is a daily driver.

Bruce

 

[illflem]

Considering the number of people here who have jacked their timing to 15. 5-16. 5 vs. the number of reported blown engines I can't see that it's harmful in the slightest.

 

[Futures1]

Give them a break;

Think about it !!!

You bombing pros are really confusing some of the newer owners and those with mostly stock engines!!! To radically advance the timing on an engine owned by a person who can read it, is a far cry from a person who can't. The thousands of people subscribing to this site are absorbing what is being written in these threads. They are hungry for more information. I'll bet that a lot of subscribers have no idea what modifications have been made to some of these trucks which achieve 400+ HP...

A man ask's a question: "what is a good tire to put on my new Dodge and 20 guys come in and say something like "I've got SMT'585X 99X74's and I pull 50K up mt everest every day". They go out and crank a few things up because they saw it written and guess what happens.

It really isn't fair ( Some of this stuff belongs in the competition forum.

There, thats my 2 cents on that !!

 

[pathaymond]

Pyro is preturbo I know the rules on egt. the timming was to be set at 15. 5 By one entity south of Atlanta. Then I now understand the other person set it by ear!

What was done is not what matters to me right now. I have stated many times to the servicing peaple I need logevity and a little more pulling power. seems simple enough to me considering some of the stories I hear about. As to weight of tow only 8K been in lots worse tugs with 12K Pre Bombing. I thank everyone for there honest whole hearted replies. I have however made my decision based on real information from Cummins. they built the engine they should know. and if I am not satisfied with the performance I will be happy to sell it to anyone who wants to buy it and they can play timing all they want. I wanted a bit more power and it seems I got that but at the expense of longevity. That is unacceptable. But it has been done. I have my eyes on a couple Larger trucks. If I can find one in All wheel drive I will likely buy it and be done with the little dodge. 1 degree over the cpl is my goal. can not and will not sell someone a truck that was not set up to the guidelines I am told Cummins has set.

Thanks Guys Patrick

 

[1dslram]

Pat:

You don't need help or advice as you have made your decision. I have friends that work for and are Cummins mechanics, that advise the timing based on the modifications made to the engine, as it should be. On a stock engine advancing the timing is of no benefit and could be harmful, but a modified engine could easily use 20* advance or more.

Bruce

 

[Futures1]

"Right On" Patrick;

I hope your engine makes a million miles, as it should !! Please keep me posted, perhaps one day I will get to meet you. I plan to move to TN in a year or two, who knows !!



Dick S.