6 Month Oil change??

[RustyJC]

If there's an unused plugged oil pressure port on the filter mounting housing (the same place you'd typically run a line for a bypass filter), that would be a good spot for a sample valve. Because of the frequent oil changes required by my non-DEF 6.7L, I don't sample and haven't looked on mine for a place to take samples.

Rusty

 

[AlFischer]

As new as your truck is, an oil test done now will come back horrible......the metal numbers will be high because of break in wear, other numbers will be wacked out because of assembly lubes, sealants, etc.

Sam

THAT makes sense! So I don't bother with sampling the first change, right? First change was 7500 miles and 9 months. Mostly towing, not driving like a LOL on Sunday. Mostly long runs and no run under 20 miles. When could a valid sample be taken. What I am concernee with is I question blindly changing at 6 month intervals and low miles. Sounds like a waste of money and not environmentally sound. Appears to be a dealer profit margin requirement! (Yeah, I'm a cynic!)

BUT, I want to have some proof (or dis-proof) of my point. Therefore, I really need to understand how to take the oil sample and when. When and how should I take the next sample?

 

[Jim W]

I agree with Rusty that adding a sampling port to an unused port in the oil flow would be great if practical. I also know that taking a sample from the bottom of the pan is also doable, this is what I do.

I have installed a Futomo drain valve in the drain plug port that is in the pan. I start the engine and let the oil warm up by driving the truck around; I will than park the truck and prepare the truck for an oil change. Next step; open the valve and let the oil flow for a few minutes 5-to 6 minutes, place oil sampling bottle in the flow stream and let it fill up. I than will craw out from under the truck and have lunch continuing to let the oil flow into the drain pan. From experience I have found out that the oil in the engine will take around 30 minutes to drain out of the engine completely. I will than change out the filter and replace with a clean dry filter. Refilling the oil and checking the oil level cold and hot; when checking hot let the truck sit for at least a ½ hour after turning off the engine to get an accurate level.

My samples have been taken this way since new and have shown no wear other what is normal for 80,000 miles.
Jim W.

 

[Ram4Sam]

THAT makes sense! So I don't bother with sampling the first change, right? First change was 7500 miles and 9 months. Mostly towing, not driving like a LOL on Sunday. Mostly long runs and no run under 20 miles. When could a valid sample be taken. What I am concernee with is I question blindly changing at 6 month intervals and low miles. Sounds like a waste of money and not environmentally sound. Appears to be a dealer profit margin requirement! (Yeah, I'm a cynic!)

BUT, I want to have some proof (or dis-proof) of my point. Therefore, I really need to understand how to take the oil sample and when. When and how should I take the next sample?

I would think that most of the bad stuff went out at your first oil change.......I wouldn't overthink the sampling method, Blackstone probably has a procedure for the testing, just do that. On my 2001, I did a test every 25,000 miles with good results. I got the engine to operating temps, removed the plug, let it drain a few seconds, then filled the bottle. Which, now that I think about it, is the way Blackstone says to do it. Six months does sound extreme and wasetful but the science of an oil analysis will confirm or tell you otherwise. When Blackstone sends you the oil report, they will recommend an oil change interval based on the science and not company profits, or the evic, etc.

Sam

 

[AlFischer]

That's kinda what I thought. What I would LIKE to do is send in a sample before draining it to see if it is needed. The Futomo drain valve would pobably allow a controlled draining to extact enough for a sample. I just hadn't even considered the amount that the break in would affect the test!

What is interesting to me is the comparison of the 2014 Ram and my 2014 Passat TDI. VW called me after 30 days for a quick look see and a comlete fluid check and top off. (including DEF) The book and the dealer says change at 10K or 1 year. And VW is dping the change with Castrol Synthetic. Dodge use Pennzoil 15W40 and the book says 6 months! So my plan at this point is to extract some oil at the 6 month from 1st change and have it tested. If it indicates time to change, then I will withdraw my concern with the 6 month interval . I will continue with Delo400 LE. It meets Cummins requirements and seemed to take care of my 2001.

 

[JLandry]

The Futomo drain valve would pobably allow a controlled draining to extact enough for a sample.

It definitely does.

I recently installed a Fumoto drain valve on my truck prior to taking it in to the dealer for it's first 6-month oil change (free). I probably only lost about a 1/2 cup of oil swapping out the original drain plug for the new Fumoto drain valve.

Next I drained enough oil for a sample. It only takes 3 or 4 ounces.

The resulting oil analysis report is attached.

Best regards,

John L.

 

[JR]

]


http://www.blackstone-labs.com/vacuum-pump.php

 

[AlFischer]

It definitely does.

The resulting oil analysis report is attached.

Best regards,

John L.

Thanks for the PDF. VERY interesting! Being that my oil is most likely contaminated from the drain pan an funnel I used I am going to wait 6 months and take a sample. By then I will have the Fumoto to install. The fact that the was ZERO water maks me feel that the water/acid should not be a problem. However, the first change apparently is justifiable at a short interval and low miles.

 

[AlFischer]

]


http://www.blackstone-labs.com/vacuum-pump.php

Pushing 1/4 refrigeration tube down the Cummins dipdtick tube doesn't sound good. The dipstick is a tight fit! Might be OK on a straight tube.

 

[Too Tall]

Well, I live in Central California and humidity is pretty low. Also, my driving pattern is at least 20-30 miles for the shortest trip. The norm os 100+ towing 10K. So I doubt the condensation issue applies in my case. If I was on the East Coast if most certainly could factor in. I left NJ 55 years ago and don't plan on returning!!

Al,
If they wrote the specs for Louisiana, they'd have me changing oil every months based on humidity. :-laf (my feeble attempt at a joke). I agree with you, the way you use your truck and where you live, I just don't see why going past 6 months would hurt a thing. My service manager here in Louisiana even said, just go by the EVIC and don't worry about the 6 months thing. I know that doesn't make it correct but there's a lot of people thinking the same way.

I lived in Ventura for 8 years in the 80's so I know what you mean about the humidity. Working for an oil company I've lived and traveled quiet a bit and I must say Ventura was the absolute greatest place I've ever lived.

As far as the drain valve, I've considered that but decided against it when I found out the threads stick up into the oil pan so you don't get a complete drain. It's probably not much but this was brought out in a thread on the Cummins forum. (If this is not true, I hope someone will speak to this.) Seems like they would flute or slot the end of the thread but maybe it would compromise the strength. The other thing, Also, I wish they made them out of steel instead of brass. I know it is above the frame level but it is possible for a piece of debris to shear that little valve right off. I also wish they would thread the inside so you could put a NPT pipe plug in the valve when it is closed, just in case it started to leak. I once had a piece of 1/8" flat steel plate about 4" square flip up and punch a hole in my oil filter on my Goldwing motorcycle so I'm more paranoid about debris than most would be. The oil filter was not sticking down below the engine and was in what most would think is a pretty safe place. The next day I installed belly pan to protect the oil filter and also the plastic coolant reservoir. If I ever did install the Fumoto valve, I'll would add some sort of metal protector/ deflector skid plate or whatever to protect that little thing. These are just a couple of things I'm concerned about, I'm not trying to talk anyone out of installing one. I'd love to have one if I wasn't so anal about these two issues. It sure would make changing oil easier but then there's the filter. #@$%!

 

[AlFischer]

I am possibly as anal about debris as you. Traveling on 40 in AZ at about 70 MPH I 'found' a chunk of steel that some ^%$^^ idiot had drropped. It broke the rear sway bar link and then hit the front mounted generator of the trailer. Ben the 1x1 square tubing I has made the mount from and then destroyed the generator case. If the generator were not there it would had been INSIDE the trailer.

I was not aware the Fumoto was brass and would not let all the oil drain. Not good. It is a ball valve so leks are unlikely. there is a model that has an extension that will take vinyl tube. I will try to see if a length of Tygon tubing will go down the dipstick. Copper refer tubing would not bend readily.

 

[Larry Willard]

Al,



As far as the drain valve, I've considered that but decided against it when I found out the threads stick up into the oil pan so you don't get a complete drain. It's probably not much but this was brought out in a thread on the Cummins forum. (If this is not true, I hope someone will speak to this.)



I had always heard that the Fumoto drain valve would hold oil in the pan when it was drained. There was a thread many years ago about drilling a couple holes in the threaded area of the valve to allow the oil to drain out but I never did it. When I had decided to buy a new truck in '07 and after ordering it when I changed the oil and wanted to save the valve for the new truck I removed it and no additional oil came out. The threads go up inside the pan, so to me that makes sense.

 

[AlFischer]

NO ADDITIONAL oil cam out??? And the threads go up into the pan?? Don't make sense to me!!

 

[Too Tall]

Frequently asked questions from their web site: Apparently a rumor or they fixed the problem. I think that's what Larry was saying.

http://www.qwikvalve.com/product-related-questions.html#pro-10

Q: Does my Engine Oil Drain Valve protrude into the interior of the oil pan and prevent full drainage of my engine oil?
A: No. The threaded oil drain plug hole is always reinforced to accept the threaded bolt of the drain plug. Your Engine Oil Drain Valve will not extend past this threaded portion of the drain hole and will allow the oil to be properly drained. Your Engine Oil Drain Valve will let you drain your engine oil while it is hot without burning your hands and it is much more effective than trying to pump the oil out from above.

 

[Jim W]

I am possibly as anal about debris as you. Traveling on 40 in AZ at about 70 MPH I 'found' a chunk of steel that some ^%$^^ idiot had drropped. It broke the rear sway bar link and then hit the front mounted generator of the trailer. Ben the 1x1 square tubing I has made the mount from and then destroyed the generator case. If the generator were not there it would had been INSIDE the trailer.

I was not aware the Fumoto was brass and would not let all the oil drain. Not good. It is a ball valve so leks are unlikely. there is a model that has an extension that will take vinyl tube. I will try to see if a length of Tygon tubing will go down the dipstick. Copper refer tubing would not bend readily.

Al,
Most if not all of the engine oil pans that are manufactured today are stamped steel being shaped in a die to the configuration that is required for whatever engine they are designed for. Thus the pans are a thickness that can be formed in a press and die; say anywhere from 18 gage steel to 3/16 of an inch thick. Thus when the hole is punched for drain plugs and other attachment points on these pans a weld boss is added to the inside for threads, these could be up to 1/4 in thickness or more depending on material needed for thread support. So the engine oil pan will never be totally drain all of its oil when changed, leaving behind the thickness of the weld boss support in the pan. This will not harm your engine in any way at all.

The Fumoto valve will not pass beyond the boss thickness on your oil pan. I have had a Fumoto valve installed on my oil pan since the second oil change and never ever worried about the thread height of the Fumoto valve in the oil pan.

Jim W.

 

[JR]

Pushing 1/4 refrigeration tube down the Cummins dipdtick tube doesn't sound good. The dipstick is a tight fit! Might be OK on a straight tube.

I've never had any problems. I do have smaller tubing for my other vehicles but it is a non issue and what it is designed to do

 

[AlFischer]

I've never had any problems. I do have smaller tubing for my other vehicles but it is a non issue and what it is designed to do

With 1/4" copper refer tubing?

 

[JR]

No, with the supplied tubing they provide with the pump

 

[AlFischer]

No, with the supplied tubing they provide with the pump

OK that sounds better. They also state that you can use 1/4" refer tubing. THAT would have a problem negotiating th dipstic tube!

 

[Camperman]

I change the oil in my 2012 when the EVIC gives the change oil soon message. I see 9-10,000 miles a year. I see it as cheap insurance.