Dead Pedal revisted 2013+

[Wiredawg]

Friends,

Just viewed You-Tube video... there are lots of parameters: RPM, vehicle speed, Gear/TQ Converter locked, total of 5 each 10 minute logs. I need to study this and figure out tests to accomplish. Here are videos I checked out. Pretty amazing.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...C3BDC16D3DC75310780CC3BDC16D3DC7&&FORM=VRDGAR

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...020A9E650C78CB009786020A9E650C78&&FORM=VRDGAR

Cheers, Ron

 

[SnoKing]

Two things in play. You had to be into the throttle, backed off for a second or two, then back hard in to it. I can replicate the condition. However I have learned to roll into the throttle.

File a complaint on safercar.gov as a safety issue. The more people that do that the sooner RAM will be required to fix it.

 

[Wiredawg]

Two things in play. You had to be into the throttle, backed off for a second or two, then back hard in to it. I can replicate the condition. However I have learned to roll into the throttle.

File a complaint on safercar.gov as a safety issue. The more people that do that the sooner RAM will be required to fix it.

Chris,

We both know and have shared that rolling into traffic is the BEST way to deal with our trucks, but I'm talking about extreme situation where traffic is heavy enough to have to give it heavy throttle. What I want to learn is HOW much I can give it before TQ Management has negative impact on acceleration. Because I was trying to get into heavy traffic and paying more attention to getting out of the way, I don't recall how much pedal I gave it, but it wasn't to the floor. If I had to guess, it was likely 80% to 90% throttle.

Do you recall what is the highest percentage of throttle you've ever rolled into it? We've never really discussed that part, which I think would be helpful in this thread. Plus, my truck weighs 12.2KLbs, I have no idea how much yours weighs and I imagine you have the HO engine.

I've hit probably somewhere between 60% and 70% max pedal, but now I want to find the max i can do it. I'm pretty sure I can figure out in 4 to 5 runs.

Looking forward to hearing more about your experience in heavy acceleration.

Thanks for sharing,

Ron

 

[SnoKing]

Again it only happens for most when you let up on the and get back on it right away again. You should be able to duplicate it.

 

[Wiredawg]

Chris,
My problem was I laid maybe 80% into it and it was lagging. It only recovered when I got out of it, upshifted AND got back into it. Still, looking for input from you on what in your estimation is the MAX you roll into your pedal for max acceleration, not towing?

Ron

 

[SnoKing]

I have no idea of max amount. I told you how to test it.

 

[Wiredawg]

How you told me to test it isn't the issue... it was the solution. My problem was stepping too hard into it AND it was accelerating too slowly (lagging)... the fix WAS letting off of it AND getting back into it. My typical rolling into it wasn't possible. Remember it was very heavy traffic starting out from a dead stop at a stop sign.

I'm not trying to be difficult and appreciate your help. AND, I guess I understand you not having any idea what is the hardest you've gotten into yours, because in about a year and a half, this is the first time I got into mine this hard. This is why I'm posting back into this thread that now I understand what some have complained about the lagging.

So, we're good. I'm going to take the truck out, AND do some experiments where I do some aggressive acceleration, including flooring it. Not for everyday purposes, but to determine what my max acceleration capability is.

EDIT: And, it may very well be at my limit and just have to manage it.

I'll post my results.

Thanks again,

Ron

 

[SnoKing]

Again, it only seems to happy when one let's off the throttle then gets right back on it again. Go find a deserted road and test it.

 

[nukegm]

I have the g56. No dead pedal or pedal lag. But torque management is programmed by speedometer speeds.

I can see that torque managment ends completely at right around 60 mph. There is a higher level of torque management below 40 mph. I can manually shift through the gears. And hit 4th gear at 40-45 mph. At that speed, i can hit the resume on the cruise control and it will slowly speed up to 55-60 and then at 60, it will lay me back in my seat and take literally 3 seconds to go from 60-80 mph. It frustrates those who come up an interstate entrance ramp behind me and see me not speeding up fast at 45-50. Then as they are passing me, they can't pass me because my torque management just hit the speed where it no longer restricts torque and cruise control resume is suddenly rocketing me forward. It can be frustrating to me and other motorists

comrade newsa- i 100 % agree with your post. the g56 in my 18 2500 has noticeable torque management in the 2nd to 3rd shift. the " lag " can even make my head bob forward until the engine or pedal catches up with itself. truck runs like a train rippin above 50 - 60.

 

[Mike Wenrich]

As the OP posting I can say that misery loves company. I'm not in this alone. Ron, the worst for me is when I turn onto a major two lane highway or enter a freeway that has a short on ramp. When turning from a stop the Aison trans shifts rapidly to second and of course I have to let off slightly or lose traction. That is when the lag is severe, much like what has been said here. At speed I learned to downshift when needing to pass or increase speed rapidly. But from a stop it's dangerous. The major highway I turn onto daily has a curve to my left and a short straightaway to my right. Traffic is traveling anywhere between 55 and 80 coming at me. I look left and right several times before turning onto the highway. That short time between looking both directions often will have an oncoming vehicle come into view. Then I have calculate if the speed of the vehicle is in excess of my ability to get out of the way. The device I added does not help me when starting and then letting off the pedal. I don't know why that is but it did shorten the delay time a little. Still, it sometimes is a white knuckle event. I suspect you will find similar results when testing. Rolling into the pedal gradually does lessen the delay but that does not get me out of the way of oncoming traffic. If only ALL the trucks did this it could be described as torque management to save RAM warranty costs. But some do, some don't. So why can't RAM fix ours to perform correctly?

 

[JR]

I've never experienced dead pedal stomping on the throttle from a dead stop. There is noticable tq management off the line, particularly in 1st, but I can matt it to the floor and it'll go. It's that time where you hesitate, let off and get back on where it falls on its face for a few seconds (feels like eternity).
If your gonna go you have to commit.

 

[brillmtb]

so I have bad lag. I posted on this in the past. My dealer spoke with someone who stated there is definitely tq management programmed in. Throttle booster didn’t really help. Smarty tuner helped a little but still there. This is an interesting observation. If banks would give me a unit I could return I would test it on my truck and know for sure if it helped. Don’t know if they would be willing to let me return if it didn’t work but the lag is really annoying

 

[SnoKing]

so I have bad lag. I posted on this in the past. My dealer spoke with someone who stated there is definitely tq management programmed in. Throttle booster didn’t really help. Smarty tuner helped a little but still there. This is an interesting observation. If banks would give me a unit I could return I would test it on my truck and know for sure if it helped. Don’t know if they would be willing to let me return if it didn’t work but the lag is really annoying

Modify your driving style and it will go away for the most part. If you want to drive a go/stop jack rabbit go buy one. If you drove my truck you would say it has trouble dead pedal issues, if I drove yours dead pedal would be gone, unless I wanted to create it.

 

[brillmtb]

My style of driving changes depending on the conditions. The dead pedal is there all the time. Worse when coming off then back on the throttle. My beginning driver, daughter, who was hardly driving hard noticed it and thought there was something wrong with the truck.

The dealer contact admitted it’s built in. It seems that some trucks have it worse than others. I know that those driving the Aisin notice it more it seems.

My 2003 2500 was way better at take off and hand no lag coming off and going back on throttle.

Nope this isn’t my style of driving. It’s the truck. Too much management going on. And to think I paid thousands more just to get the transmission that was supposed to be able to handle this motor. Apparently they want to just get it past warranty mileage.

 

[brillmtb]

Curious if the newer 1000lbs tq experience the same issue. I understand they improved the Aisin along the way. Perhaps enough to roll back all the management.

 

[Mike Wenrich]

I've been watching SnoKings responses for years now to this problem and frankly he doesn't have a clue what we are going through. He has good advice at times but this is not one of them. He can reproduce the problem because it's built in to a lesser degree than ours. He does not drive the roads we do. And he does not have as severe a problem. The trucks ARE different. Some do not even have the problem. So I wish he would opt out of this discussion because it's bad advice. It's good advice if all you ever do is gently roll into the speed. Yes I can get mine to do that too. But I would be road kill in a heartbeat if I drove like that in kalifornia. I have seen no indication this is a learning transmission. Maybe the 68 is but not the Aison. It has not learned my style what-so-ever. And I drive the same roads every day. We have a severe problem, documented by RAM techs in my case but they will not reprogram for us. Really sucks considering what a great truck this could have been.

 

[Larry Willard]

I have never experienced dead pedal from a dead stop, only when accelerating then off and immediately back on it hard.

 

[dieselshadow]

I’m no expert here, but I’d be willing to bet it had something to do with emissions. Remember the older trucks, if you rolled on the throttle, no smoke. But if you lost boost and jumped back on it, you had some smoke as the engine used some excess fuel prior to the turbo spooling up. My bet is this is a bit of some strategy in the “we are still learning how to keep emissions low” stage.

 

[Wiredawg]

Friends,

Thought I would pop back in...I like all the discussion. I guess my truck works fine about 99% of the time. I did look at my CTS2 and it's logger is amazing. It actually records most sensor inputs for ten minutes and has 5 logs. Now, I don't need to pay attention to anything but driving the truck while the logger gathers the data. I just want to see how well I can dial in max acceleration. My truck is so heavy, I don't have to worry about breaking the rear tires loose.

Now I know what the CTS2 will do, I will try to play with the truck this week and post it here.

Thanks OP and others as we at least better understand this issue.

Cheers, Ron

 

[Ozymandias]

Do people mix up Torque Managment with Traction control?

If I stomp on it from a dead stop it will spin the wheels even with 7000lb on the axle. My old one lacks a Traction Control.