New Era 435s vs DDP4s.... RESULTS!!!

[bmoeller]

huh?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06Jgsy-NoGA



little 62 cleans up pretty good once it lights! on the street, it goes clean about 1800

I don't have a 62.



Besides, I'm not talking about the dyno runs. Mine will do the same thing. I'm talkingabout on acceleration with a lighter foot. The 370's I had, ALWAYS had a light stream of black smoke on accel.

 

[woodsrat]

Same timing with both injectors right Ben? So what does the timing have to do with his findings?

12valve injectors are a little more touchy to timing. As I have stated the 435's seem to like about 16. 5 deg and when I talked with ben on the phone today his injectors are not spraying outside of the bowl. The DDPs are good injectors and ay work great with the 22 degs or may be better at another setting. As stated we rework stock tips unless they do not pass inspection then we use new bosch tips.

 

[zstroken]

I stand completely corrected. I had several conversations with DDP last year and I could have swore they told me they EDM's the tip then honed it. They use an OEM tip, with the correct spray angle and EDM that. Not a Dodge engine application tip. So my bad I was wrong... . again!!!

 

[Forrest Nearing]

I don't have a 62.



Besides, I'm not talking about the dyno runs. Mine will do the same thing. I'm talkingabout on acceleration with a lighter foot. The 370's I had, ALWAYS had a light stream of black smoke on accel.

I was saying "huh" to they can get dirty on the bottom... my truck barely smokes at all when I drive it around... even driving it agressively... over time the foot controls the smoke perfectly

 

[Cooker]

Not a Dodge engine application tip.

You are correct about this. Ross said it was an OEM tip but not OEM to Dodge.

 

[Cooker]

12valve injectors are a little more touchy to timing. As I have stated the 435's seem to like about 16. 5 deg

My question is, assuming the 435's maintain the stock spray angle for the Dodge bowl and assuming the DDP's do this as well, why does the timing have any impact on why the DDP's perform better than the 435's?



Maybe Ben was running a little too much timing for 435's but wouldn't that also be too much timing for the DDP's, assuming the spray angle of the injectors is the same?



Are there other factors that come into play when talking about timing other than the spray angle?

 

[zstroken]

I am suspecting the spray angles are different. The DDP could have a tighter spray angle, and as someone mentioned washer thickness could come into play.

 

[Cooker]

I am suspecting the spray angles are different.

I am leaning towards this as well. I would really like to know for sure.

 

[woodsrat]

My question is, assuming the 435's maintain the stock spray angle for the Dodge bowl and assuming the DDP's do this as well, why does the timing have any impact on why the DDP's perform better than the 435's?

Maybe Ben was running a little too much timing for 435's but wouldn't that also be too much timing for the DDP's, assuming the spray angle of the injectors is the same?

Are there other factors that come into play when talking about timing other than the spray angle?

Well I dont have a straight foward answer for you. I know Bens 435's are not spraying out of the bowl. DDP may have a different patteren, I have never had a set so I cant tell you, unless you want me to BS you about it.

 

[zstroken]

The 435's are a good bang for the buck though.

 

[Cooker]

Well I dont have a straight foward answer for you. I know Bens 435's are not spraying out of the bowl. DDP may have a different patteren, I have never had a set so I cant tell you, unless you want me to BS you about it.

I appreciate your honesty

 

[Morse]

I have been very happy with all my DDP injectors. I run the 90's in my 05, and I started with the DDP4's in my race truck. They lit the 66/big brother twins fine without blowing much smoke at all. . It would blow just a little if you matted it, and quickly clear up. They then made me a set that was quite a bit larger. I didn't get much of a chance to play with those. .

 

[wildmanben]

Washer thickness. I am running the . 5mm washer on the DDP4s. I used the thicker ones with the 435s that Chuck sent me. I suppose that would make a difference in the spray pattern?

 

[zstroken]

Spray pattern would be the same, but the point where it hits the piston would be different.

 

[Cooker]

FWIW - In regards o washer thickness, Piers mentioned one time that it was his experience that even with stock injectors the . 020 washer performed the best.



Since I trusted Piers, almost every set of injectors I have ran in my truck have been run with . 020 washers.

 

[tshort]

As far as the DDP4's go, I was told that you SHOULD NOT run more than 20 degrees timing with those. That was straight from Lenny. The reason I found out is because I am currently having my head fire ringed and studded by Shane at Doc Automotive, some of you may know him through his VooDoo ladder bars and his PSI fuel systems. My truck has the timing set at 21. 5 degrees and I noticed that the spray pattern wasn't exactly in the bowl like it should. Lenny said that running anymore could cause some serious problems eventually.

Just so you know.

Ryan

 

[wildmanben]

Well looks like I may have to back the timing down then huh?

 

[Jim Fulmer]

I was told that you SHOULD NOT run more than 20 degrees timing with those

Like I said, they don't have an EDM machine to change the spray angle. Are they a good injector? From what I know... yes. Are they they the end all..... nope.



Have you even seen a dual feed 10x16 12V injector?



Jim

 

[JCutter]

I thought they started with new blanks (no holes) and went from there. Where do they get the 8 hole inj. for the 24v then (stock is 7)? What about the custom made 4 -11 holes thats been made?



If they can do that cant they make the pattern different for more timming.

 

[Cooker]

I thought they started with new blanks (no holes) and went from there. Where do they get the 8 hole inj. for the 24v then (stock is 7)? What about the custom made 4 -11 holes thats been made?



If they can do that cant they make the pattern different for more timming.

I don't now about their 24v injectors or anything else that has left DDP's facility but when I talked to Ross the other day he said they start with OEM tips, not OEM to Dodge, but OEM tips.



Yes, if a shop can put more holes in a tip, EDM, or put holes in a blank tip, EDM, they would have the ability to change the spray angle to some extent.