Rebuilt Engine Water in Oil

[PaulJohnson]

Just put my engine back together. This was a complete rebuild top and nottom end. Started it for the first time. I have white smoke (steam) coming from the tailpipe and valve cover and water mixing with the oil. Vehicle only ran 5 minutes and it already turned the oil milky. I used all OEM cummins parts on the rebuild including the gaskets. I used the head bolt torque sequence that was in the cummins service manual.



44 lbs/ft torque

77 lbs/ft torque

Back off 360 deg.

77 lbs/ft torque

90 deg. turn



Any suggestions, anything I may have left out?

 

[HBarlow]

This may turn out to be a very expensive bargain Dodge-Cummins.

 

[JWadford]

I would pull the head and start inspecting

 

[JWadford]

Just put my engine back together. This was a complete rebuild top and nottom end. Started it for the first time. I have white smoke (steam) coming from the tailpipe and valve cover and water mixing with the oil. Vehicle only ran 5 minutes and it already turned the oil milky. I used all OEM cummins parts on the rebuild including the gaskets. I used the head bolt torque sequence that was in the cummins service manual.



44 lbs/ft torque

77 lbs/ft torque

Back off 360 deg.

77 lbs/ft torque

90 deg. turn



Any suggestions, anything I may have left out?

where do you live ?

 

[PaulJohnson]

Buford, ga

 

[JWadford]

if you lived by me i would help you but im alooong ways away

 

[Motorhead]

Did you pressure check the engine oil cooler?

 

[JWadford]

Did you pressure check the engine oil cooler?

how would you go about that, not saying that isnt the problem because it very well could be

 

[Motorhead]

It is my understanding that you have to remove it from behind the oil filter and have it pressure tested. I just re-read your post and saw that you are having steam from the tail pipe. The oil cooler wouldn't cause that. Sorry.

 

[Chowderhead72]

So would a warped head. Did you have the head milled or inspected?

 

[PaulJohnson]

I guess I'll pull the head Sunday and check for a blown/ defective head gasket. Should I visually be able to see the head gasket damaged? Whatever it is, it would have to be pretty big because it dumped a lot of water int he oil quickly. It's letting water into the combustion chamber. Can someone check to see if my head bolt torquing sequence is correct. 77 lbs/ft plus a 90 degree turn seems a little low to me.

 

[PaulJohnson]

I did have the head milled (10 thousandths) and inspected at the machine shop.

 

[RVTRKN]

I imagine it will be the head gasket if your getting water in the combustion chamber. I can just imagine your face when you started it, it reminds me of what I did a long time ago with a Mopar 318 and timing gears. I checked three times for timing marks alignment, what a hassel. It turned out to be the computer with a weak timing chain before I started so when the chain and gears went back in, she wouldn't start or it ran like hell. I was embarrassed and had to take it to a dealer. The tech kept insisting it was the timing marks, but I stood my ground and he found the computer in the air filter housing had corroded connections. :{ #@$%!

 

[Wingate]

Steam in the exhaust means that you have coolant in the combustion chamber. I assume this is a common rail engine since its in this section. Try pulling all the injectors and disabling the CP3 pump... (maybe unplug it so it won't spool up and start trying to pump fuel??) and spin the engine over. Watch and see which cylinder/cylinders throw coolant out of them. I've done this hundreds of times on big Cats, but never on a Cummins. Atleast you will have an idea before you pull the head. Make sure you have safety glasses on and do NOT have hands or face over the injector bores when you do this!!!. Even a small amout of liquid can come out of the bore with damaging force.

Could be a cylinder head issue, head gasket, or even a crack in the cylinder block.

Another idea is to pull the injectors and pressurize the cooling system. Then bore-scope the cylinders for coolant. Snap-On makes a VERY NICE full color screen hand held bore-scope that is relatively inexpensive.

I would definitely try to determine where the issue is before ripping the engine apart.

 

[JWadford]

Either way the head is going to have to come off

 

[PaulJohnson]

I pulled the head this morning and still do not see anything that screams at me. It is a common rail engine... . a 2005 Dodge 2500. The head gasket looks perfect. For those of you that don't know the story behind this truck it is a flood salvage truck. It was flood on the dealer lot in 05 and has 13 miles on it. I have replaced all the electrical and had the top and bottom ends gone through ( new pistons, bearings, valves, etc. ) One cylinder was pretty bad pitted and got a sleeve. The other 5 cylinders were ok and they were bored out 20 thousands. Head was decked 10 thousands and new intake valves installed ( exhaust valves are stainless so they were fine). The head gasket will only go on one way and it doesn't look to have leaked so I am going to rule that out for now. There is some pitting in the combustion camber that did not come out when deck, should I be concerned? I am at a loss now and pretty bummed out. I wish I would have done the test Wingate suggested before pulling the head to at least narrow it down to a cylinder or cylinders. I thought I would be able to tell by coolant on top of the pistons or a very clean (steam cleaned) exhuast outlet or cleaner piston but I guess I did not let it run long enough. I guess the head will be off to the machine shop (again!) in the morning. I am afraid the head is damaged internally somehow due to corrosion. Anything to check while the head is off? I will keep you updated.

 

[JWadford]

Can you post some pictures of the cylinders and head, do you know if the flooded engine was running when flooded, or was it turned off, do you see any cracks in the cylinder walls, im sure you already did this

 

[PaulJohnson]

It wasn't running when flooded, it was sitting on a Dodge dealership lot when flooded. I will post the pics of the pitting and see what you guys think. I didn't see anything on the cylinder walls.



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[sag2]

That pitting would not concern me at all.

Before you send the head out why not try this. If you have access to a pressure tester carefully fill the block with water to the deck height. Reinstall the head with the old gasket and seal all the hoses. Pressure test and see if the water stays there or enters the crankcase or a cylinder. That might rule out the block, and it just takes some time. You can leave the turbo off if you can seal up the coolant lines to make it easier. As the injectors are already out just leave them out also. Also no need to torque the head, just snug the head bolts down to about 50 ft/lbs and that should be fine. If the water stays there it must be in the head and the machine shop should be able to pressure test it. Don"t forget to turn the engine over one half turn to get the pistons in a different position in case there happens to be some porosity in a cylinder.

 

[sag2]

Steam in the exhaust means that you have coolant in the combustion chamber. I assume this is a common rail engine since its in this section. Try pulling all the injectors and disabling the CP3 pump... (maybe unplug it so it won't spool up and start trying to pump fuel??) and spin the engine over. Watch and see which cylinder/cylinders throw coolant out of them. I've done this hundreds of times on big Cats, but never on a Cummins. Atleast you will have an idea before you pull the head. Make sure you have safety glasses on and do NOT have hands or face over the injector bores when you do this!!!. Even a small amout of liquid can come out of the bore with damaging force.

Could be a cylinder head issue, head gasket, or even a crack in the cylinder block.

Another idea is to pull the injectors and pressurize the cooling system. Then bore-scope the cylinders for coolant. Snap-On makes a VERY NICE full color screen hand held bore-scope that is relatively inexpensive.

I would definitely try to determine where the issue is before ripping the engine apart.

Unfortunately the Snap-On tool is very nice but it does not fit down the injector hole. It is just slightly too large.