Considering a 4th Gen

[Wiredawg]

Good Morning,
I am contemplating selling my ‘06 2500 4x4 manual to my son and purchasing a used 4th Gen. I would like any feedback from this community on the why’s and why not’s. An alternative, is locate another ‘07 or older (which is not real easy).

I have been contemplating ‘08 to ‘12 model years - 100K - 150K mileage range. I am looking at upgrading to a 3500. Have not settled on SRW or DRW at the point. We pull a 34’ 5ver and I like the potential for DRW stability, which is basically all our truck is and would be used for.

I have done a fair amount of research and have identified varying opinions, which I know I’ll get here as well due to individual experience, about the older Aisin transmission and the Chrysler transmission’s. Also, that there is perhaps a difference between the UREA systems and the DEF system. Maybe get some decision points regarding why or why not from this communities perspectives which I can then vet out myself.

I have and continue to appreciate the feedback, input, and cautions that this community has offered over the years. I have spent most of my time in the 3rd Gen forum and look forward to the perspectives of those who post here and may venture over from ‘other gen” forums. Maybe there are those who have both trucks or who have recently made an upgrade/update.

Thanks much,
Scott.

Sorry about the deep dive on HGs, but I think what you are looking for is doable and the Internet is your friend. There are lots of folks who dont put a lot of miles on their trucks AND keep great maintenance records. For example, I traded my 09 Ram 4500 Crew Cab 4x4 two years ago with only 68K miles, complete fuel and maintenance logs, never wrecked for $30K. It sold about a week later for $35K.

I think you may be surprised how much you'll pay for a non-def truck in great condition. I recommend checking Ebay as well as general search in Google. Another place to look is in the RV arena. Unfortunately a lot of folks decide to get into RVing late in life and either find it's not what they thought or worse get sick and cant do it. Sad to feel like you're taking advantage of someone's misfortune, but they are out there.

Anyhoo, hope you keep us posted on your efforts and good luck finding your next Ram.

Cheers, Ron

 

[Jim W]

Ron, I agree with John and what he said about the HG issues. I have been running the Smarty S67 on CaTCHER level 3 since I installed the program in 2009. I now have close to 110,000 miles on the truck and transmission since I went to CaTCHER level 3 about 25,000 without the Smarty installed.. I do watch my boost pressure and EGT's when I am towing, trying to keep the boost pressure under 30 and the EGT's around 800 to 1100 F, I will manually shift between 5th and 6th gear as needed. The transmission is in tow haul mode with the engine exhaust brake turned on.

 

[SnoKing]

There is no reason to avoid a DEF truck. Better mileage and less emission issues in many ways. Another plus is you can get an Aisin transmission in the 3500's with the HO engine.

 

[AH64ID]

There is no reason to avoid a DEF truck. Better mileage and less emission issues in many ways. Another plus is you can get an Aisin transmission in the 3500's with the HO engine.

DEF trucks are much better options if you plan to keep it stock or near stock.

Another bonus, aside from the ‘13 2500, is the upgraded frame and suspension.

 

[Wiredawg]

Ron, I agree with John and what he said about the HG issues. I have been running the Smarty S67 on CaTCHER level 3 since I installed the program in 2009. I now have close to 110,000 miles on the truck and transmission since I went to CaTCHER level 3 about 25,000 without the Smarty installed.. I do watch my boost pressure and EGT's when I am towing, trying to keep the boost pressure under 30 and the EGT's around 800 to 1100 F, I will manually shift between 5th and 6th gear as needed. The transmission is in tow haul mode with the engine exhaust brake turned on.

As you can pretty well imagine, I'm kinda burned out on the whole HG discussion, so my where I'm at is not saying it's not a problem, just trying get get some order of magnitude.
I guess I never had HG issues on my 09 4500 and not so far on my 17 5500 as the Aisin always seems to keep the engine where it needs to be. As mentioned before, I got away with running the 09 on Catcher Level 5 without any problems. I had both boost and EGT gauges, and although hard to remember back, dont think I ever hit over 32PSI boost. I had remarked way back when in the C&C forum that deleted, that truck was the perfect towing machine.

I'm really surprised my 17 5500 doesn't hit very high boost either, seeing high 20s. Hard to say if not driving the truck hard, having 4.44s on the 09 and 4.88s on the 17, and different tune on the engine, smaller power band, and different programming on the Aisin contributes to not having any issues with the truck.

So, I guess we are both examples of PROPERLY managing power enhancements and NOT experiencing any issues whatsoever.

Cheers. Ron

 

[AH64ID]

While it’s a known issue it’s not an issue most of us will have to deal with, plain and simple.

Don’t dwell on it in the least, these are pretty bulletproof motors in stock and near stock form.

 

[SnoKing]

Towing around 20-21K combined with my 2001.5 bomb'd a bit, I had to drive the EGT and transmission temp gauges. It was great to get in the 2015 at 24,500 combine and just drive it with confidence that it will not hurt it's self.

Now I look at the distance to empty read out, fuel and DEF level gauges occasionally, and have a much more relaxed journey.

 

[Wiredawg]

While it’s a known issue it’s not an issue most of us will have to deal with, plain and simple.

Don’t dwell on it in the least, these are pretty bulletproof motors in stock and near stock form.

Thanks, I'm better.

Towing around 20-21K combined with my 2001.5 bomb'd a bit, I had to drive the EGT and transmission temp gauges. It was great to get in the 2015 at 24,500 combine and just drive it with confidence that it will not hurt it's self.

Now I look at the distance to empty read out, fuel and DEF level gauges occasionally, and have a much more relaxed journey.

I had Amsoil bypass filter system plumbed through a transmission cooler to cool engine oil. GCW 28KLbs. I literally drove by the EGT, Boost, And Coolant temp gauges, which was nerve racking driving out West where there are some real grades.

Although I installed all the gauges in my 09 4500, EGT, Boost, nor Coolant Temps were NEVER a problem.

That 3500 had 198K miles when I sold it, and I would never have done that had it not been for really bad left ankle couldn't manage the clutch pedal anymore.

Thanks for sharing, had about 60K miles towing heavy and worried about being over everything but tire and axle ratings.

Cheers, Ron

 

[SnoKing]

which was nerve racking driving out West where there are some real grades.

Cheers, Ron

All of my towing is out West! Living near sea level, everywhere we go is up a hill or mountain pass. Having an exhaust brake is a god sent and it used just about everywhere you go in Western States. We will be off to Arizona again in late September, going over the Cascades to Eastern Washington, up Rabbit Ears(Deadmans Pass) on I-84 in Oregon and all bumps to Twin Falls, Id and then South down through central Nevada at 6000-6500' elevation, then all the ups and downs on 93 South of Kingman, Az into the Phoenix area.

Sometimes we go farther inland to Utah and others through California. Southern Oregon on I-5 has lots of smaller passes and then the Siskiyou Mountains at the Oregon/Cal border. Came North one year on April first, the only day that week that it did not have fresh snow. Several times heading South we had to route to 101 on coast to bypass the snow on Siskiyous. Last fall we were one day ahead for the snow on I-90 in Montana and then down I-15/Utah. With the 2001.5 we did Wolf Creek in Colorado which is a doozie, and towed through the Salt River Canyon in Arizona a couple times. On I-8 West from Arizona into California you go from below sea level to 4000'+ in a short distance.

 

[AH64ID]

I literally drove by the EGT, Boost, And Coolant temp gauges, which was nerve racking driving out West where there are some real grades.

Cheers, Ron

One of the major reasons I’m a huge proponent for custom tuning.

I rarely had to shift for EGT issues on the 05, and usually that was due to lower rpms than I should have been at. I was able to run at 20K combined up a 4-5% grade above 6K feet at 72 mph in OD and have nothing to worry about. 95-100% load.

Box tunes wouldn’t have come close to that capability.

 

[Silver Tex]

Hey All!
OP here. What a great discussion! Literally just got back from Ouray, CO. From our place north of Denver, there were (I think) 5 passes to go over with Monarch Pass (~11,075’) being the highest and probably steepest. We pull our G.D. 30BH with the ‘06 in the sig. On the way out it was 90+* even in the high country. Coolant temps hit 209* on the steepest parts of the pull with EGT’s at roughly 1150. Though we never experienced any brake fade on either the trailer or the truck, I will not make that pull or anything like it without an exhaust brake again (AH64, I was thinking about your comments down the front side of Monarch). The G56 performed well on the downgrades when coupled with the service/trailer brakes. I was impressed with the trucks performance (10 MPG out/12 MPG back - all hand calculated) with the Smarty Touch set on Catcher 5 setting. All that said, I’m still truck shopping. The towing season is pretty much over, so I have some time. Unfortunately it also means time to get information overload.

I spent a portion of our down time in “the Switzerland of America” researching trucks and searching for trucks. So I am back and I have settled on at least a 2014. NOW after reading so much about 68RFE’s versus Aisin, I am considering an 68RFE if I get the right deal. Sure, I’ll take the Aisin if it presents itself, but it probably won’t be the deal breaker that I thought it might. I might even consider another 6 speed manual. After this trip, we determined we would not need a trailer bigger or much heavier than the one we have, even if we full timed. That said, I do not anticipate getting over 20K#’s GCVW (we are at roughly 17.5K GCVW loaded currently).

So there you have it. This is what our travels will typically look like for the next 5 years or so...

Really appreciate all of the dialogue and input.
Thanks!
Scott.

 

[endoscott]

Man I am dying to go to Ouray sometime! Pictures of that place look amazing. All I can say is I have loved manual trans my whole life, still do in my sports car but once you tow a big trailer in the mountains with an integrated exhaust brake you will never want to go back. Loved my 2003 and all that but the 2014 is amazing for towing. Factor in cost of stomach lining and heart muscle/arteries....that will make the $$ easier to justify. Whats a heart attack cost these days, $100K?

 

[SnoKing]

Man I am dying to go to Ouray sometime! Pictures of that place look amazing. All I can say is I have loved manual trans my whole life, still do in my sports car but once you tow a big trailer in the mountains with an integrated exhaust brake you will never want to go back. Loved my 2003 and all that but the 2014 is amazing for towing. Factor in cost of stomach lining and heart muscle/arteries....that will make the $$ easier to justify. Whats a heart attack cost these days, $100K?

In 2007 we came over Wolf Creek passed and stayed near Mesa Verde NP. One day we did a road trip in the truck over the million dollar highway, through Silverton, Ouray and back around through Telluride, Cortez and back to Mesa Verde. It was an all day trip and scenery was great.

Parts of the down hill on Wolf Creek we were down in 2nd gear with the Bank's EB/DTT transmission/4:10's on the 2001.5 RAM and trailer at around 20K combined.

 

[Silver Tex]

Man I am dying to go to Ouray sometime! Pictures of that place look amazing. All I can say is I have loved manual trans my whole life, still do in my sports car but once you tow a big trailer in the mountains with an integrated exhaust brake you will never want to go back. Loved my 2003 and all that but the 2014 is amazing for towing. Factor in cost of stomach lining and heart muscle/arteries....that will make the $$ easier to justify. Whats a heart attack cost these days, $100K?

Endoscott,
SnoKing is right, make the trip you won’t regret it.
There is something to be said for factoring in the stressor costs associated with pulls like that! Down hill it was 3rd gear, start at 2K rpm then use the brakes to get it back to 2K rpm once it hit 2.5K rpm’s.

So...any of you 68RFE owners have any success stories?
Thanks,
Scott.

 

[Jim W]

Silver Tex,
I only have 135,500 on the OD now. Which for a 12 year old truck is not that many miles but I have had no issues with the 68RFE auto. As I have stated above I am 60HP/120lb.-ft. over stock at the rear wheels. I do tow a heavy 5th wheel trailer with my truck.

Now I have added a Mag- Hytec deep transmission oil pan which add additional 3 qrt's of trans fluid. The transmission is serviced every 40,000 miles with two new filters and new fluid.

If I was in the market for a new Ram truck I would not hesitate to buy a new truck equipped with the 68RFE again.

 

[Silver Tex]

Silver Tex,
I only have 135,500 on the OD now. Which for a 12 year old truck is not that many miles but I have had no issues with the 68RFE auto. As I have stated above I am 60HP/120lb.-ft. over stock at the rear wheels. I do tow a heavy 5th wheel trailer with my truck.

Now I have added a Mag- Hytec deep transmission oil pan which add additional 3 qrt's of trans fluid. The transmission is serviced every 40,000 miles with two new filters and new fluid.

If I was in the market for a new Ram truck I would not hesitate to buy a new truck equipped with the 68RFE again.

Good stuff Jim!
I appreciate the insight and experience.
Thanks,
Scott.

 

[SnoKing]

Wrong Thread